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Post by Aerith Gainsborough on Oct 25, 2007 1:59:50 GMT -5
Crisis Core was using Last Order clips for their Advent Children commercial. It made me very sad when I saw it.
Before Crisis claims that Avalanche existed before North Corel burned. It states specifically in the game that Barret and company wanted to visit the Cosmo Candle at the creation of Avalanche.
And I'd have to replay Dirge to give you specific examples beyond random fancharacters known as Azul, Shelke, Rosso, Weiss, Grimoire Valentine...
Oh, wait.
They cut out Professor Gast. Entirely. Hojo was Gast's assistant during the Jenova Project. Gast simply wanted to bring the Cetra back, thus Sephiroth was concieved. Hojo spent the remainder of his life trying to repeat the greater scientist's masterpiece. Seph even says so.
That great scientist is later revealed to be Gast... Aerith's father. So what happens when Gast doesn't exist? There's no discovery of Jenova "in a 2000 year old geological stratum."
"Professor Gast named that organism, Jenova..." Therefore there's no Jenova Project, no Sephiroth, no Aerith.
But then they replace all of these great things with a man named Grimoire Valentine. Vincent's father. Lucrecia apparently was in love with Papa Valentine and that's why she loved Vince. "You had his eyes. I didn't want... I didn't want to remember."
So, if Papa Valentine replaces Gast, then.... That's some messed-the-fuck-up family tree. That makes Aerith and Vincent siblings. There's a possiblity that Vince is Seph's father, so that makes Aerith his aunt? And then there's the lineage with Cloud in there. With the same Jenova "mother", that makes Cloud and Seph (and Kadaj and Co) brothers. So, there's at least five love triangles completely fucked over. Unless you say yes to incest, you see how this shit's impractical.
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Post by Alexander THE GIRL on Oct 25, 2007 20:45:07 GMT -5
I was under the impression that Barret simply named his group after the old Avalanche, and that the two were otherwise unrelated. There can be workarounds to these things. It doesn't always have to be that Square is blatantly rescanning everything like they did with Sephira jumping.
I'll give you a good one, though. At one point in BC, Avalanche captures the Junon Cannon and tries to shoot it at Midgar. According to FFVII's geography, the Junon Cannon can't aim at Midgar and the place is just too damn far away even if it could. The first couple chapters of BC are iffy like that, but I still say the rest is solid.
It seems like you're jumping to the worst conclusion here. I asked around, and they simply didn't mention Gast in Dirge. They didn't say "Oh, he was just a nobody who didn't really do anything". He just wasn't mentioned because he had nothing to do with Dirge's story. As far as I'm reading, Vincent's father worked on projects involving Chaos and Omega, while Gast worked on other projects involving Jenova. Lucrecia worked with Gast after working with Grimoire, as far as I can tell here. There was no replacement. I don't see why Gast couldn't have played the part the game says he played while Grimoire plays his part. Actually, I remember reading that in the online section of Dirge (removed from the English version for some reason), Gast was mentioned as having worked on G with Vincent's father and Hojo. Maybe the site was mistaken, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was true.
Again, there's no evidence that Gast was outright retconned out of the series just because he wasn't mentioned in the game. He wasn't totally replaced. Also, there is no possibility that Vincent is Sephiroth's father until Square actually mentions anything to that effect. It's stated outright that Hojo is his father, and the rest is simply fanfiction as far as I'm seeing.
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Post by Aerith Gainsborough on Oct 25, 2007 23:31:38 GMT -5
I disagree. Vincent's story IS the Jenova project. All of those flashbacks were during the Project when Vincent was one of the Turks on duty. It was the very fact that Gast was not mentioned at all that I'm doubtful of its legimicy. If he was mentioned as existing, even as simple as "Gast wouldn't like this", I'd be able to accept your theory. If that scene exists, I'll be more forgiving... but as it stands, there is no Jenova Project -- and no reason for Vincent and Lucrecia to have met -- without Gast.
And as far as the family tree goes, it is a stretch with roots in possiblity. It can't be misproven beyond doubt. I mean, the only real claim on Seph's parentage is coming from a raving madman who just downed a dose of Jenova. See, this is where the doubt stems from in Papa Vincent theories. I might not believe it myself, but there are many who do believe so.
Uh, isn't this back to the purpose of this thread? Hojo or Vincent as Seph's dad. Let's call 1-800-DNA-TEST
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Post by Alexander THE GIRL on Oct 25, 2007 23:53:36 GMT -5
Things are coming full-circle. XD
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Auron
Lvl 2
This is your story now.
Posts: 136
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Post by Auron on Oct 29, 2007 2:57:15 GMT -5
What the hell did I miss? Ah, yeah, sorry I've been MIA, but with my little work-place accident, I've been banned from the PC till my cast came off. And now, my cast is off! Yippee!
Time to post in the thread...I'll need a means to end up a group member, but maybe I'll just be exiting Bevelle anyway...after all, it is my world. lol
However, I don't think Sephy (sorry, used to calling Vince this on another RP site lmao) should be the only one to decide (I asssume from what's been said, that Seph is played by a girl, so forgive me if wrong) her characters heritage. I mean, if it involves Vince, he should have a say too. But hey, he's said what he thinks is appropriate, and that's understandable.
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Post by Sephiroth on Oct 29, 2007 19:04:59 GMT -5
Wow, that's why my ear have been itching...XD
Well, there's no problem for me at all...About Vincent being my father or anything, we added it last time because the story until that part was Vincent following me around and it was getting bored....
if people think it's too weird, well....we can do something like this...since Sephiroth is trying to act like a normal general and forget his past (not that he can't lose his temper someday) Vincent maybe could feel relieved and act like a father just because Seph is Lucrecia's son and have no intention to be controlled by Jenova again...
But as i say, we added it later because it was getting boring....i on't mind ignoring that part and start to rp with this Vincent again...^^
*and yes, i'm a girl...i already cosplayed sephiroth if you want to know..XDD*
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Post by Aerith Gainsborough on Oct 31, 2007 11:39:29 GMT -5
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Post by Sephiroth on Nov 1, 2007 5:39:51 GMT -5
Aw, thanks, Aerith! ^^ *hugs*
(i can't imagine Seph saying like that) XD
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Post by Xenos on Nov 1, 2007 10:18:01 GMT -5
Sounds like a nice compromise, Seph! I probably wouldn't have thought of that. I'd just bully to get my way. XD j/k.
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Post by Aerith Gainsborough on Nov 7, 2007 1:20:12 GMT -5
Oh, yeah, Alex. I don't mean to bring this whole Dirge thing up again, but I'm going to anyway.
On the Official SE DoC website, under characters, then under Hojo, it starts talking about the Jenova Project (and there's some vocabulary I can't read), then it mentions Gast. I won't apoligize for disliking that game so thoroughly for letting us down from lofty promises of Devil May Cry grandeur... and for its convoluted plot. I will apologize, however, for being such an utter bitch about it. I'm sorry, Alex.
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Post by Alexander THE GIRL on Nov 7, 2007 1:52:16 GMT -5
Apology accepted. I would have dropped it much earlier if I had know you were actually angry. Sorry for the misunderstanding. In the future, I'll just leave Compilation out of general conversation. It never seems to do well for me. XD
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Post by Aerith Gainsborough on Nov 7, 2007 2:19:46 GMT -5
nor for me
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Post by Tifa Lockhart on Nov 7, 2007 2:23:53 GMT -5
Quick question, sicne you're both active here...
What happens to a GF/Summon if their junctionee/summonee doesn't appear to be around anymore?
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Post by Aerith Gainsborough on Nov 7, 2007 2:33:16 GMT -5
well, I used to have a direct connection with Bahamut, but that player quit. Then if I needed to summon Bahamut, I would only get the one-hit FFVII style. Now that we've got another Bahamut, we need to discuss if my previous ability to summon True Bahamut is still valid, or if I need to get his permission again. But this is on the Summoner's side. If the summoner quits, then the bond is dissolved and not mentioned again since most of the rest of that character's actions are either adapted when someone adopts the role again, or dashed from the records forever... depending on how much we liked the person (lol Wakka) or how long/much they affected the story.
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Post by Tifa Lockhart on Nov 7, 2007 2:38:29 GMT -5
Ahh okay. i was just wondering since Tidus hasn't been around for...well awhile...and I feel bad for Alex having to watch from the sidelines. No offense at all to Tidus, I was just curious about what would happen in that case.
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